The ending s' Hi everyone! I have a question about a very minor thing, but it's not just this particular example, I'm just wondering if there's any general rule about it. A hundred years ago one ki

Kseniia

The ending s' Hi everyone! I have a question about a very minor thing, but it's not just this particular example, I'm just wondering if there's any general rule about it. A hundred years ago one kind person here explained to me that " James' " is pronounced [ʤeɪmzi:z]. Do you always have to add this /iz/ (or /is/?) ending when a word ends in "s" both in the plural and the singular? It's just that I was listening to one of the Harry Potter books, and both narrators (Stephen Fry and Jim Dale) pronounce " Hogwarts' " absolutely the same way as "Hogwarts", there's no extra syllable. Could someone please explain to me why? I thought it should be "HogwartsIZ" then. Have I just made that extra syllable rule up, in some cases you don't have to do this, then? In case it's still not clear what I'm talking about, here's an example from "Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire": https://vocaroo.com/7l40EaSVFDQ The Great Hall seemed somehow much more crowded than usual, even though there were barely twenty additional students there; perhaps it was because their differently colored uniforms stood out so clearly against the black of the _Hogwarts'_ robes.

Apr 6, 2020 6:12 PM

Answers · 16

This isn't really answering your question, but "...against the black of the Hogwarts robes" does not look like a possessive to me. "Hogwarts robes" is a noun phrase consisting of two nouns: the first is in apposition, functioning as an adjective. The pronunciation doesn't surprise me, but the apostrophe does.

April 6, 2020

As far as I know, there are two schools of thought on how to form the possessive of nouns which end in -s in the singular: adding only an apostrophe; or adding apostrophe+s, like other nouns. These imply two different pronunciations: the same as the non-possessive form; or adding the syllable /ɪz/ (which might be pronounced [əz] depending on your accent, but not [i:z] as you mention in your question).

April 6, 2020

This was taken from the Merriam-Webster Guide in the section on "Plural and Possessive Names" For names that end in an s or z sound, you can either add -'s or just an apostrophe. Going with -'s is the more common choice: the car that belongs to Jones → Jones's car or Jones' car But there are a few exceptions. For classical and biblical names with two or more syllables ending in s or es, you usually just add an apostrophe. If the name is only one syllable, add -'s. Socrates' students Ramses' kingdom Amos' prophecy Zeus's warnings The names Jesus and Moses are always made possessive with the apostrophe alone: Jesus' disciples Moses' law Based on this, you can either say Hogwarts' or Hogwarts's (pronounced HOG-warts-IZ). Both are correct.

April 6, 2020

If the word ends in an 's' the apostrophe is on the outside (Hogswarts' robes) and pronounced as a separate syllable. James' book "Hogwarts" is not a real word in English so possibly that's why people would not pronounce the possessive form so traditionally. Also British pronunciation tends to omit letters more than American English.

April 6, 2020

Thanks Michael, but you do add this extra syllable when it comes to names, for example! It's James'=JamesIZ, Remus=RemusIZ throughout the book! So why is it different with Hogwarts'? It may be clear to you as a native speaker but it's not that obvious to me :(

April 6, 2020

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